Vango

	i like this line > I AM A WINNER BECAUSE I AM MADE OUT OF THE STUFF THAT DREAMS ARE MADE OF (GOD) 	do think its creative 	i explained why i am a permanent and eternal winner 	i just love being a winner from my perspective losing is a illusion 	To me it looks like you shouted the same stuff you hear in a mental institution 	thats your opinion liptonand im ok people call other people crazy if the dont understand them 	from my perspective i am a genius because i love people forgive them and move on		It's the opinion that most (if not all) people that see your profile will have 	the review have been mostly positive 	And where/who did you ask? 	my yt buddys 	Yt? 	youtube 	and some people that dont agree with me		:)		Aha	<Vango>	so you dont agree with me liptondont you	<Lipton>	Yes, i do not agree	<Vango>	:) i love you just for that it would be so boribg to agree with me	<Vango>	besides no one is wrong from their perspective <Lipton>	Doesn't it ever strike you as incredibly narcissistic to call yourself God? <Vango>	no <Vango>	i think it natural to be god <Vango>	and from my perspective you are also god just like me	<Vango>	everything in the universe is god you cannot escape god god is everywhere <Vango>	not even a blind person cannot fail to ultimately see the god and goddess of the universe <Lipton>	But that doesn't mean you are God <Lipton>	Because you are not everything <Lipton>	You are just a part of God <Vango>	yes i am	<Lipton>	You are not everything <Vango>	the trees are my breath <Lipton>	You are only a part of the everything <Vango>	the water my circulation <Vango>	you live from my perspective in the illusion of separation <Vango>	everything that camed out of the big bang is the big bang] <Vango>	that how i see it	<Lipton>	Yes, the whole is made from it's parts <Vango>	you dont need to agree with me	<Lipton>	But that does not mean that the parts are the whole <Vango>	yes they are because if you relly see thing how they are <Vango>	they all become the brahman <Vango>	the brahman is the force that has all forms and no form <Vango>	the unmoved mover <Vango>	you dont have to agree with me <Lipton>	So everything is expanding every microsecond then? <Lipton>	Doubling it's size <Vango>	yes <Vango>	but isee as this we live in a universe with cause and effect <Vango>	if dont agree with im ok with that <Vango>	i dont think you like what im saying <Vango>	but we are all one has helped me more that anything in my relationships and personal problems <Lipton>	And medicine helps others <Vango>	from all the beliefs out there like polytheism monotheism atheism pantheism <Vango>	pantheism is the one that works for me best <Vango>	me entire perspective shifted <Vango>	my* <Vango>	and i have acted with more love and power than i evr dreamed <Vango>	so its a complete success if you think im nuts be blessed im saying to you this is my key to complete happiness <Lipton>	Maybe you never really got Christianity? <Vango>	no i onced was thinking Christianity was the ultimate truth <Lipton>	That is no what i am saying <Lipton>	*not <Lipton>	You can think *anything* is the ultimate truth <Vango>	no im no more saying i have the ultimate truth <Lipton>	And still completely miss what it is really about <Vango>	what is it about enligthen me	<Lipton>	So thinking that Christianity is the ultimate truth has *nothing* to do with understand what it is about <Vango>	enlighten* <Vango>	so what is it about explain lipton <Vango>	if say im not getting it	<Lipton>	Doing what Christ told us to do	<Vango>	and that is <Vango>	? <Vango>	tell me what is im intresting in knowing this <Vango>	:)	<Vango>	say it	<Lipton>	...	<Lipton>	Have you ever heard of patience	<Vango>	pk	<Vango>	ok	<Vango>	i was thinking you know it	<Lipton>	We do not exist to entertain your, nor do we exist to react instantly to you	<Vango>	i was thinking you know it	<Vango>	from my viewpoint you exist to activate your glorious awareness of who you are	<Lipton>	Loving other humans, unconditionally; Pacifism; Being faithful to your wife/husband; Be true to your word; Do not belief to make a show out of it, keep your praying etc. to yourself;	<Vango>	hahahaha > Loving other humans, unconditionally	<Lipton>	...	<Vango>	and how better to achive this be seeing everyone as amyself	<Lipton>	:/	<Vango>	myself*	<Lipton>	Then you do not love everyone	<Lipton>	You merely love yourself	<Vango>	yes i do	<Vango>	everyone+myself	<Vango>	everyone=myself	<Vango>	it fits perfectly	<Lipton>	It's a narcissistic "solution" to it	<Lipton>	It's all from the "it's about me" viewpoint <Vango>	and from my view it that solution that is most efficent <Lipton>	I do not need to "lift myself up" in order to love other people <Vango>	do on others how you would like to be done upon you <Lipton>	I can love others without having them to be me	<Vango>	yes but do you know what love is do you know what sex is <Lipton>	Of course i know, do you? <Vango>	when you make sex there is only one person the merge of the 2 persons its the unity <Vango>	unity = one self that my take on it	<Lipton>	But sex is not love <Lipton>	And sex without love does not result in any kind of unity <Vango>	yeah if you put fear in it	<Lipton>	Sex without love is just a activity wherein 2 people try to feel good, using each other to achieve selfish goals <Vango>	but why is selfish to feel good <Lipton>	It is selfish to use others to make yourself feel good <Vango>	so how can you love someone if you dont feel good <Lipton>	Do you need to use the other person to feel good <Vango>	helping someone can make you feel good <Lipton>	? <Vango>	why would god put something to feel good about and not do it	<Lipton>	It is not about feeling good <Lipton>	It is about *using others* to feel good <Lipton>	Those are two completely different things <Vango>	and what the wrong in that <Vango>	whats* <Vango>	is it wrong to use something to feel good <Lipton>	That you are using other people for your own selfish reasons <Vango>	and is ti bad <Lipton>	Acting like they are nothing more than a tool to achieve some goal <Vango>	we are tools of service <Vango>	what the wrong in using other as tools <Vango>	whats* <Vango>	are they lifeless than <Lipton>	It degrades them from humans into tools <Lipton>	Something that you can use when you want to	<Lipton>	And can discard when you want to	<Vango>	what society uses us as tools <Lipton>	... <Lipton>	It's useless to discuss things if you have a memory span of 10 lines of text <Vango>	arent you used by society to sustain it <Lipton>	Do i agree with society? <Vango>	yes arent we tools in society <Lipton>	... <Vango>	people use us all day long <Lipton>	Don't make such idiotic assumptions <Lipton>	It does not help your argument in any way <Vango>	even you use people all the time <Lipton>	I *do not* agree with the way society works <Vango>	dont you use the farmers the suppliers the goverment <Lipton>	And i think the system we use (capitalism) is completely unsustainable in the way it treats both nature and humanity <Lipton>	I do not use them <Lipton>	They do something for other people <Lipton>	And in turn we do something bacl <Lipton>	*back <Vango>	yes but how do you know that you equal that you dont even if you have money <Lipton>	What? <Vango>	a product is far more expensive in 3rd country <Vango>	so where is the equal in that how do you know you are fair <Lipton>	<Lipton> I *do not* agree with the way society works <Lipton>	<Lipton> And i think the system we use (capitalism) is completely unsustainable in the way it treats both nature and humanity <Lipton>	Where did i ever say that i agreed with capitalism or that it is a fair system? <Vango>	i know you said that but im say dont you use people <Lipton>	A vast minority is allowed to work cushy jobs where they have freedom to do what they want <Lipton>	A vast majority is forced to work in certain jobs against low pay helping to make a small group of people at the top rich <Vango>	the pyramid of humanity <Vango>	80% resources go to 10% of the poeple maybe even less <Vango>	i dont agree with society either <Vango>	they need to change the system if not they will autokill ourself <Lipton>	And i do not use those people <Lipton>	I facilitate the system that uses them to a small extent but i try to minimize, if not eradicate, that <Vango>	to eradicate it means to change it because if hte community dosent sustain you can only minimixe it	<Lipton>	I can get my food from local farms and the like <Lipton>	People who grow the food themselves and distribute it outside of the retails channels <Lipton>	That way i eradicate my involvement with the negative side of capitalism <Lipton>	Which is the best that is possible at this moment <Vango>	yes but you still use people to accommodate you its far more easy than for you to produce your food or hunt for it	<Vango>	you go to local farm <Lipton>	I do not use them <Vango>	it still using people but you make a trade and its fair but you use them <Lipton>	They produce certain goods, and i exchange those goods for other goods <Vango>	yes but you still use the as channels <Lipton>	It is a clear agreement and we stay within that agreement <Lipton>	Neither of us takes anything from the other <Lipton>	I *do not* use them <Lipton>	If i used them i would force him to take the money i want to give <Vango>	maybe i cannot explain this very good <Lipton>	Or to force him to grow a certain kind of food <Lipton>	Or exercise any kind of power of him <Vango>	using isnt forcing someone <Lipton>	o take unfair advantage of; exploit: to use people to gain one's own ends. <Lipton>	It is	<Vango>	using is like i scratch your back and you scratch mine <Lipton>	Not it is not <Lipton>	That is helping each other <Vango>	imagine your the last man on planet earth <Vango>	and you have all the money in the world you wont have any benefit <Vango>	because you have no one to provide goods or services <Vango>	am i correct <Lipton>	And your point? <Vango>	is that poeple scratch your back and you scratch their you use them in order not to spent you time making food but doing something else <Lipton>	You don't use them <Lipton>	You help each other <Lipton>	You gain nothing, you lose nothing <Lipton>	You *do not exploit them* <Vango>	oh yes you win <Vango>	you dont have to do everything <Vango>	if it where to be the last human on earth and you would want everytinh <Lipton>	Nor do force yourself in a better position by buying food or similar actions <Vango>	ok i if it where to be the last human on earth and you would want everything you would need to give yourself everything so in truth you use other as a system in order that you dont need to do everything <Vango>	so in theory you win <Lipton>	How do you exploit a farmer by buying his products? <Vango>	you dont need do them yourself <Lipton>	That is not exploiting <Vango>	yes it not <Vango>	it using <Vango>	using people to get want you need <Lipton>	to utilize, esp. for profit; turn to practical account: to exploit a business opportunity. <Lipton>	to use selfishly for one's own ends: employers who exploit their workers. <Lipton>	That is exploiting <Vango>	and no one ever said using is exploiting <Lipton>	It does not happen in any way if you buy directly from a farmer <Lipton>	... <Vango>	ok you not getting my point so i will stop explaining <Lipton>	<Lipton> o take unfair advantage of; exploit: to use people to gain one's own ends. <Lipton>	The dictionary definition of using <Lipton>	Exploiting someone <Vango>	that is not my dectionary says <Lipton>	... <Vango>	dictionary says <Lipton>	It odes <Lipton>	*does <Lipton>	http://dictionary.reference.com/browse/use <Vango>	no may because it Romanian <Lipton>	5. to take unfair advantage of; exploit: to use people to gain one's own ends. <Lipton>	And it is the definition i have constantly and clearly used throughout this conversation <Lipton>	Citing it directly 3 times now <Vango>	yes that is true <Vango>	to employ for some purpose; put into service; make use of: to use a knife. <Vango>	2. to avail oneself of; apply to one's own purposes: to use the facilities. <Vango>	3. to expend or consume in use: We have used the money provided. <Vango>	4. to treat or behave toward: He did not use his employees with much consideration. <Vango>	and i used to word use as	<Lipton>	And i have clearly used definition 5 <Lipton>	Throughout this conversation <Vango>	to employ for some purpose; put into service; make use of: <Lipton>	And not once did you say you disagreed <Lipton>	So any problems stemming from that were caused by you <Vango>	ok you undertand it as exploiting <Vango>	ok <Vango>	understood* <Vango>	ok <Vango>	i dont see selfish as a wrong thing it healty to be selfish <Vango>	besides you sell fish (selfis) :) do you get it	<Vango>	that a service	<Vango>	you know some one made a international survey on what people want	-->|	Lipton1 (n=Lipton@dhcp-077-250-119-091.chello.nl) has joined #wikia-fiction	<Vango>	you know some one made a international survey on what people want	<Vango>	and they all said they want peace love and happiness	<Vango>	i think to be selfish is to be more self common good	<Lipton1>	If everyone is selfish then how can there be peace?	<Vango>	it in my selfish behavior to eat healty food breath clean air and drink pure water	<Vango>	people are just confused they dont know who they are	<Lipton1>	And it is selfish to assume that you can simply have something because you want it	<Vango>	you take action	<Lipton1>	Why do countries start wars?	<Lipton1>	Because they want something	<Lipton1>	It all comes from being selfish	<Lipton1>	A feeling of entitlement <Vango>	no because ther are 2 country's	<Lipton1>	Some twisted idea that a group of people are better than others because of some arbitrary line made up by other humans <Vango>	if there were just one country there would be no wars <Lipton1>	There would be civil wars <Vango>	yes <Vango>	but this is one of those thins like what if	<Vango>	what if all people would see themself ass everything <Vango>	as* <Lipton1>	As long as people are motivated by selfishness there will be wars and crimes and the like <Vango>	well what if you exapnt the self <Lipton1>	Then there is even less reason why you shouldn't just take something <Lipton1>	Because everything belongs to you already anyway <Vango>	but wait you are forgeting you are other poeple <Lipton1>	So? <Lipton1>	It doesn't matter that i take something from them then <Vango>	would you dare act inhumanly to yourself <Lipton1>	Since if i use it they benefit from it too <Lipton1>	If i get better from it, sure <Vango>	so would you kill yourself <Lipton1>	As long as it's a small part of me	<Lipton1>	There are new parts of me born every day <Lipton1>	There are parts of me dying every day <Lipton1>	One more or less wouldn't make that much difference then <Lipton1>	Heck, there are many parts of me dying as we speak in Iraq <Lipton1>	So why should it matter than if it happens there or if it happens here? <Vango>	if called to put yourself in another shoes to be that person <Vango>	its* <Lipton1>	What? <Lipton1>	There is no other person right? <Lipton1>	It's all me right? <Vango>	yes <Vango>	so would cause youself pain <Lipton1>	If i get better from it	<Vango>	:0 <Lipton1>	Especially if i don't notice it	<Vango>	you make my :)	<Lipton1>	(see, your theory falls apart in seconds when viewed from a selfish perspective)	<Vango>	no it dosent because it not selfish	<Lipton1>	It is	<Vango>	that person on the street is me	<Vango>	its me	<Vango>	it not someone else	<Lipton1>	So?	<Lipton1>	It's still selfish to want whatever he/she has	<Vango>	:) so you are saying to me you dont care about yourself <Vango>	you would steel yourself <Lipton1>	It's not about caring, it's about what puts me in a better situation <Lipton1>	And if that involves me taking something then so be it	<Lipton1>	Besides, again, if it's me then i should care even less <Vango>	if you see some suffering and the one who suffers is a you would you not help them <Lipton1>	Since the other person should still experience positive effects from me having that <Lipton1>	Depends on if i get better from it or not <Vango>	you not being one with everyone <Lipton1>	If we are one and i would improve from not helping it would mean that the other person get's better too <Vango>	it not about better <Vango>	it about you you look into a mirror <Lipton1>	Sure it is	<Vango>	ok you just gonig if its all me it all mine <Vango>	i dont blame you <Lipton1>	But we are all one <Lipton1>	So that is good right? <Lipton1>	Because any improvement to me means a improvement to everyone? <Vango>	that is what i thought fist <Vango>	first* |<--	Liptonhas left irc.freenode.net (Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)) <Lipton1>	(again, your theory falls completely flat with a selfish person) <Vango>	ok <Vango>	if you are one with the universe that wich you call selfishness transfomres into helping other rather thena getting it	<Vango>	you see i was thiking the same when i didnt understood oneness <Vango>	there more you give to others the more you get <Vango>	no the other way arond <Vango>	and i understand you <Vango>	that was my first impression <Vango>	you dont get better by taking but by giving] <Vango>	i made that mystake first <Lipton1>	And that is why you never understood Christianity <Vango>	because i never understood how a allpowerful god loving and knowing can send you into hell <Vango>	i understood hell can only be made by you because you are your master and only you give your destiny <Lipton1>	Then you did not understand the first book <Vango>	explain :)	<Lipton1>	We have been given a choice, free will	<Lipton1>	And for free will to exist there need to be 2 options	<Vango>	yes	<Vango>	correct	<Lipton1>	This is *not* something God choose, he advised against eating from the tree	<Lipton1>	But Eve (and Adam) did not listen and we gained free will	<Vango>	so freedom is a blessing	<Lipton1>	And thus we get free will and need 2 options in everything	<Lipton1>	Including the after life	<Vango>	yes but she dosent decide you decide	<Vango>	you have freedom so chosee	<Lipton1>	I think you mean He	<Vango>	in the afterlife hell or nirvana	<Lipton1>	As in God	<Vango>	no she	<Lipton1>	(since He doesn't have a gender anyway)	<Vango>	i see god as he and a she	<Lipton1>	God has no gender, so we use the normal naming system	<Vango>	if it is genderless why not use she	<Lipton1>	Which leads to God being called a He	<Lipton1>	Like we do with objects too <Vango>	you are not wrong if you use she <Vango>	are you <Vango>	it could also represnt personality traits <Lipton1>	Grammatically you are <Vango>	female as in caring and male as in courageous <Vango>	could you use this as gender <Vango>	rather than a sexual thing <Lipton1>	I am not talking about a sexual thing <Lipton1>	Like i said, God doesn't have a gender <Vango>	how do you know <Lipton1>	But from the grammar rules that exist He is called a He	<Vango>	what if god is both genders <Lipton1>	Because Adam and Eve were both made in His image <Lipton1>	This is useless <Vango>	yes exactly my point what if god is a he and a she <Lipton1>	Not, your stupid turning around the point is useless <Lipton1>	O and the completely ignoring my responses too <Vango>	is god all powerful i ask you this <Vango>	if yes <Vango>	could she be both genders <Vango>	so no response would be wrong <Lipton1>	Could He create a rock that is unliftable and lift it? <Lipton1>	Ooh look a paradox so God is not all powerful!!11! <Vango>	no and yes <Lipton1>	Those kinds of question are just... childish and completely useless <Vango>	you it quite easy <Vango>	no it not childish <Lipton1>	It is childish <Lipton1>	In a bad way <Vango>	listen <Vango>	if i say it unliftable its unliftable <Vango>	unless <Lipton1>	It's a dumb paradox created by human language <Vango>	it not dum <Lipton1>	So it's useless and childlish <Lipton1>	It is dumb <Vango>	it quite east <Lipton1>	Any idiot can come up with it	<Vango>	easy <Lipton1>	And the answer to it are dumb too since the question is so dumb to begin with <Vango>	ok listen a ant cannot pick a basketball a human can so it all about perception if you are a ant or a human <Vango>	so its posiible depending on perception <Vango>	if your jesus you can walk on water <Vango>	its all about perception <Vango>	see it not dum <Vango>	it about perption <Lipton1>	... <Lipton1>	That is not even close to the subject <Vango>	oh my friend it is	<Vango>	its perception it matter were you stand <Vango>	i can give you a better example <Vango>	in my daydream i am all powerful true <Lipton1>	No, you stray from the matter into some weird other subject under the pretense it is the same subject <Vango>	so if i want to i can imagine myself not powerful to lift a rock <Vango>	so did jesus walk on water <Lipton1>	it is not and i stop caring if you try to pull such a switch on me	<Vango>	how did jesus walk on water <Vango>	i have my explantion <Vango>	he undestood reality as a dream an was capable of manipulating it	<Vango>	this is how is see reality as a dream <Vango>	do you believe god is allpowerful <Vango>	? <Vango>	do you <Vango>	? <Vango>	lipton <Vango>	what is your answer lipton <Vango>	?? <Vango>	i believe in god ass a allpowerful self <Vango>	so god from my opinion would have no problem in creating a universe like tom and jerry <Vango>	ok if got mad on me ok im said it once i will say it again this is my view <Vango>	this is how i am seeing things maybe i am to in your face <Vango>	are you ok dude <Vango>	ok i got it your mad ok 	<Vango>	man and i was

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